Wednesday, December 5, 2018

John 17 Jesus prayer. Does Jesus only pray "for those given to Him"?

John Piper, Wayne Grudem, James White, and many more extremely influential Calvinists use John 17:9 
<<I am asking on their behalf; I am NOT asking on BEHALF of the WORLD, but on behalf of those whom you GAVE ME, because they are yours">>
They use the portion that says "I pray not on behalf of the world" to say that Jesus only ever prays for the "elect" given Him by the Father before the world was. But John 17 is a whole prayer, there is more things prayed for in John 17.



((If I was praying specific things for my wife alone. I would say "I'm praying these things for my wife, not other women" but then I went on a prayed for all other women, saying that I don't pray for other women because the first part of my prayer was for my wife, saying I don't pray for other women would be false right?))
That is what happens to John 17:9, lets look at the rest of the prayer to see if He only prays for "The elect" and not the "world"


John 17:20I ask NOT ONLY ON BEHALF OF THESE>> 
("THESE" are The 12 Apostles (minus Judas) who were there in the immediate context, He is only among the Apostles, the previous statements were in general, a prayer for them), (That contextual interpretation can be debated but you will loose😃😃😃)


<BUT ALSO on behalf of THOSE>> 
(making a distinction between the Apostles with Him at the moment, and the people who would come to believe, through the Apostles message)


<who will believe in me through "their word" 21 that they may all be one. As you, Father, are in me and I am in you, may they also be in us, SO THAT THE WORLD MAY BELIEVE THAT YOU HAVE SENT ME>>,
(That who may believe? "THE WORLD" And what is believing in Jesus? Salvation right? Believing in Jesus is always about salvation)


<. 22 The glory that You have given Me I have given "them">>
(What Glory? The power to cast out demons, to heal, to raise the dead, to do what Jesus did and more. Do we have the Glory of the Apostles? No, so clearly the intent of the author is directing this statement directly to the Apostles with Him, how that applies to us can be discussed, but contextually that is what is happening)

<So that they may be one, as we are one,
23 I in them and you in Me, that they may become completely one,SO THAT THE WORLD MAY KNOW YOU SENT ME
>>

(He prays for the Apostles, then for believers, then for the world 2 times)

<and have loved them even as you have loved Me>>. (end of prayer)
He prayed distinct things for all people. You see 2 times in John 17 Jesus goes on to pray for the "world" so when John 17:9 is quoted as a proof-text Jesus does not pray for the world, is a misinterpretation.
That is why the Scripture says "do not let many of you be teachers, for we all stumble in many ways" Because lots of people can (though well intending) have very wrong interpretations of Scripture. People need to be taught how to read Scripture like any other ancient document. You would not just pick up a old writing and take out sentences, and explain to people what the document means. So let's no do that with our most precious possession, our Bibles. -Kevin Henderson

"Calvinist Manichean Gnostics" well your'e "Provisionist Pelagains": Even Scales?

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